Hannah: 0:01

Excuse me Sorry.

Mom: 0:04

You're the best burp. Sorry, mom.

Hannah: 0:05

That was weak.

Mom: 0:07

You're always a good burp, even when she was a baby. She can really belt them.

Jess: 0:13

Yeah, she never had a tummy ache.

Mom: 0:15

Okay.

Hannah: 0:19

Hello Wanderers. I'm Hannah and I'm Jess, and this is Wicked Wanderings.

Jess: 0:26

Hi Jess, hi Hannah. How are you? I'm good, I'm good. How are you doing? I'm good. Are you ready for today's episode? Yes, I got my red wine ready that you so lovingly gave to me, so let's do this.

Hannah: 0:40

You're going to need it for today's episode. It's a heavy one.

Jess: 0:44

So it's good thing we have the bottle in the room.

Hannah: 0:46

Yes, it's very good we have the bottle in the room, so I have a little spiel. To begin with, I like to think there's a difference between faith and organized religion. I agree With faith. It is your personal relationship with whatever power to be you believe in. An organized religion is man made here on earth, and sometimes that encompasses the evil side of humanity.

Jess: 1:09

Yes, you agree, 100, actually 1000%.

Hannah: 1:14

This is the story of Danny Croto, a young boy whose faith was shattered and he probably lost sight of it due to organized religious crime, because of an evil priest in the cover up by the Catholic church. Oh, it's one of those stories. Okay, this is a trigger warning for this episode. We are going to talk about sexual, emotional and religious abuse and it's not going to be easy to talk about, but we want to tell this young man's story and hopefully bring awareness to the crimes that have been committed by people standing behind the Bible and the veil of the church. This episode is hard for me to talk about because of the religious component. It also happened in an area I grew up near and I work with kids. It's kind of another doozy. I'm getting chills already. Danny Croto was bludgeoned with a rock, strangled and tossed into the Chikabee River. This is his story.

Jess & Hannah: 2:03

Geez, you just went right for it, I did.

Hannah: 2:05

Okay, but today we also have a special guest that has their own personal experiences that they would like to share, and it's my mom.

Jess & Hannah: 2:13

Hi mom, Hi mom, Hi Tess, Welcome to Wicked.

Hannah: 2:17

Wanderings, thank you. Usually she's behind the scenes feeding us or giving us wine, but today she's a part of the episode.

Jess: 2:24

Hey, we're so excited mom Drinking tea. She said she's drinking tea, she's being good, she's saving the red wine for us.

Hannah: 2:32

The reason my mom is here is because she grew up in the 16-acre Springfield neighborhood and she has her own personal experiences that her family went through during this time. So as I'm reading through, mom, just cut me off and tell the fans what they want to know. You got it.

Jess & Hannah: 2:47

Okay, excellent.

Hannah: 2:49

A man wanted to fish the Chicabee River in western Massachusetts back on Saturday, april 15, 1972. When he got down to the water he noticed a jacket and when he approached further, noticed a body and splattered blood. He ran back up the hill to his car where he noticed more blood and he ran to the nearest junkyard to find a phone to call the police. To give some background on the area of Springfield Mass, it was a mainly Irish and French Canadian settled city which is very differently diverse today. Catholicism was the prevalent religion and, due to this, churches and other missions done by the church funded things in the area, such as parochial schools and orphanages.

Hannah: 3:28

Danny's parents met because his grandparents rented the first floor of their two-family house on Masses-Soyet Street in the Irish area of Springfield known as Hungry Hill. Danny's mother moved in with her divorced mother and her little brother After Danny's father came back from Korea. Because of the war, his parents got married and bought their house on Furncliffe Avenue in the 16-acres neighborhood where Danny and his family lived. Danny's mother, bunny, affectionately said he was a real boy, who reminded her of Huckleberry Finn, which I thought that was kind of sweet.

Mom: 3:58

Just totally, what a totally true statement. Yeah, yeah, he was kind of a happy, go lucky kid. I just remember him as being a little wise, cracky, funny. He was kind of a happy kid, but a little bit on the fresh side. You know 12-year-old boys, I think was around 12. Yeah, yeah.

Hannah: 4:19

Like he was a jokester with a good heart is really what his mom was saying.

Mom: 4:22

Yeah, he wasn't yeah.

Hannah: 4:24

Their household had seven children under 14, so, as you can imagine, it was chaotic but full of love and laughter. Danny could be a mischievous and would occasionally be part of a fight. He was also known to have older male friends that would give him cigarettes, marijuana and dirty magazines. He also spent time with a local neighborhood group of travel makers known as the Circle. They would frequent the area under the library parking lot where there was a large tree with benches circling it, hence the name of the Circle. Danny would be a part of shoplifting, smoking marijuana and taking the communion wafers as snacks.

Jess: 4:58

So deviant there.

Hannah: 5:00

Did you want to talk about the Circle at all, because I think you had some insight into it too.

Mom: 5:05

When they built the new library, they put this lovely reading area out in the back with a huge tray I think it might even be an oak tray where people could take their books and go out and read, and it was soon taken over by teens that were older than I was and they were called the Circle gang, but they weren't my gang. Maybe they were smoking cigarettes and drinking a beer back there. They were just the cool kids. Yeah, they thought they were, I suppose. Yeah, they thought they were the Croto.

Hannah: 5:36

Children attended Our Lady of the Sacred Heart Catholic Church, also known as Ulsh, where the Sisters of St Joseph staffed and taught the school. The nuns would use corporal punishment, which entailed for children to kneel on pencils, slapping or punching them or beating them with anything that was nearby, such as books, rulers or pointers. I went to school there.

Jess: 5:56

Really Two years? Did you have to kneel on pencils?

Mom: 5:59

Oh, I was a good student.

Jess: 6:01

She was a good girl, so can I add just a weird story to this?

Mom: 6:04

Yeah, absolutely.

Jess: 6:06

My sweet, innocent mom, who is Mormon, told me she wanted to be a nun. Oh, and she's like, well, they're so sweet. I'm like not the stories I've heard, I've heard their mean.

Hannah: 6:21

But anyway, yeah, because I think about like, even like the indigenous schools. Yes, oh my God.

Jess & Hannah: 6:26

Nasty old ladies.

Mom: 6:28

I was only there for two years, so I was kind of small to be in kindergarten for a grade.

Jess: 6:34

Oh, yeah, yeah.

Mom: 6:35

It's more the older kids that get, but I do remember kids getting their knuckles wrapped with rulers and it was normal or threatened with going to see the priest. That was. We were scared of the nuns, yeah Well yeah, we were scared of the nuns. I was very happy to go to public school, when I was a second grade Interesting. But yeah, that was if you weren't behaving. You were going to go see the priest and you knew that if the nun dragged you in to see the priest, the power of the church the power of the priest.

Mom: 7:08

I think you probably have to talk about that, because the priest and especially for a Catholic, I mean my dad is Irish Catholic and they were, you know, God's representatives here on earth. And, boy, he certainly didn't want to interrupt him because you were blowing around.

Jess: 7:26

Let me tell you yeah, I don't know much about like. I mean, I married into a Catholic family, but I've heard stuff here and there.

Hannah: 7:36

So let us inform you. Yes please do. Also. Another punishment that was actually a favorite was when they would put the students back into their chairs in such a way where they'd be able to beat them with a belt. And the thing with the belt is like you never like. When you spank a child, right, you know how it feels against the skin, but with a belt, you don't know how much that hurts or how many you're doing right, I mean, yeah, I don't recall ever saying anything like that in there.

Hannah: 8:02

That's good. This way of life now seems archaic and cruel, but it was the norm during this time. The Catholic faith was an ever present norm in the Croto family life. Springfield consisted of church and Irish control. The Irish mafia and the diocese controlled the city, even to the point where the church held sway over the local paper, the Republican. Really, the editor-in-chief was close to Bishop Christopher J Weldon.

Hannah: 8:26

Weldon was a harsh man and not really liked by his own priests. He seemed to have his own agenda. Priests were put on a pedestal and having a personal relationship with your priest who entered your home and shared meals with you, was a type of honor. Getting advice from mental health therapy to your finances was common, because these men were your ticket to God. To have your son serve as an altar boy was a great honor. And when priests showed special interest in your child, where they would share private meals with a priest, accompany them on a ride to a meeting and even have sleepovers at the rectory, it was not looked at as odd but as another way to ensure your child's and family's salvation.

Jess: 9:01

But well, I mean, I have a feeling where this is going. Yeah, and what has come out in the news in the last couple years?

Mom: 9:13

But it was nothing like that there, yeah, and that that type of Attention was something that was seen as an honor. I do remember many arguments between my father and my brother because he wanted to my brother to become an altar boy and my brother was having God rest his soul. My brother was having no part of that, really, he just had no interest in it. He was a pretty committed agnostic from the get-go, probably out of the womb.

Jess: 9:44

So it's just something that the young boys would be excited for too, or was it more the parents?

Mom: 9:49

I think it could be both. I don't know. Maybe if there was a young man who had a true calling, maybe he would be, excited, but I think it was just something that the parents had them do.

Jess: 9:59

Like Boy Scouts or anything else.

Hannah: 10:02

It probably seems like, especially in the Catholic families, if you had a son, he would at least serve as an altar boy for a short amount of time. If you were someone, that was very what's the word? I'm looking for Attending the church a lot Like you were very involved with it.

Mom: 10:16

My mother actually stuck up for my brother, I remember, during those arguments, because my mother had been brought up Protestant and had converted to Catholicism because back then when they got married in the 50s, you couldn't marry, you couldn't do an interfaith marriage. So to her the whole concept of an altar boy and just the reverence and the admiration that you gave your priest, that was kind of foreign to her because she had a pastor and he had a family and he had a wife and he was human. So she had a whole different kind of take on it. So he didn't want to be an altar boy.

Hannah: 10:50

She didn't care. To me that's not an interfaith marriage. It's so interesting that you bring that up, because Protestant and Catholic I mean it's the same God, so it's not like you're going. I don't know Buddhist or something, something totally different. So that's interesting.

Jess: 11:07

Yeah, I mean it's the same with Mormonism and Catholicism.

Mom: 11:12

Really.

Jess: 11:13

Like we couldn't Dave and I couldn't have gotten married in like a Mormon temple and I don't think we could have gotten married in a Catholic church. No, yeah, that's true, either so Chicape Town Hall. That's where we Thank you, chicape. And then we went to Hooters, but I digress. Okay, that's definitely a story I need to hear. Good times.

Hannah: 11:34

The Croto family attended St Catherine of Siena on Parker Street in Springfield, where the family was involved in many different ways and were highly connected to their Catholic faith. Their whole world would change on May 6th 1967, when a new priest was appointed to their parish. Father Levine was a strange child, as people put it. He had an inappropriate relationship with his mother, where they would both laugh when he would grab her breasts and ask if they were real.

Jess: 11:59

What the fuck? Sorry, it gets weirder, sorry for me.

Hannah: 12:02

They were seen in the backyard sunbathing, her topless, and him with his hand on her breasts. How old was he at this point? Old enough not to be holding his mother's breasts? Yeah, mmm. Most kids would hunt squirrel or frog, but Levine took it too far. He enjoyed watching them die and would sometimes inject them with bleach and then give them an elaborate funeral. People said they knew he would be a priest.

Jess: 13:59

I mean, is that a prerequisite Is to kill animals? I thought that was for serial killers, not for priests.

Hannah: 14:05

Ting ting, ting ting. Red flag, but not red flag enough. Did you know any of this Mom?

Mom: 14:13

No, no, I mean 1967, I was very young. I do remember when he came to. So the rector of the church was quite elderly, father Griffin, he was quite elderly.

Hannah: 14:30

And he had a drinking problem. I think, I read, I think, most priests do.

Mom: 14:33

I'm sorry to say that, but I knew most of the priests that you know when, and I'm not even going to call him by anything other than his class name. When Levine came in, my mother God rest her soul too took it immediately, just immediately, disliked him.

Hannah: 14:51

Grandma was good at discerning people. Yeah, she knew he was.

Mom: 14:54

Really, I can remember her saying to my father I there's something about that man, I don't like him. I don't like him. My father was like I, you know, I know there's nothing wrong, he's fine, he's just young. I don't know how old he was at the time, but I do remember when he got to the point my mother would not go to Mass when he served. Oh really, and there was one incident that I witnessed and this just shows his irreverence for stuff.

Mom: 15:19

They were, they prepped the altar and a lot of times the priests will come out in just a cassock but not all the garments and it looks like what you might wear if you're an alkylight or something. And he came out and they were getting the altar ready and they bring out, you know, whatever, whatever they bring out and whatever they do. And he came down and St Cats had a communion rail that went all the way around, like most, and that church was kind of built in the 60s, so I had that vibe. And he went and put his hands down and vaulted over the communion rail into the sanctuary and my mother never wanted to be shy, was a large gas from her because we were sitting down getting ready for Mass and then after that she said I don't like him, there's something wrong with him, but what do you do with that information?

Hannah: 16:11

I mean, it wasn't that person Like what can you do?

Mom: 16:13

Yeah, the speculation, you know, and you didn't just because you didn't like the way a young priest behaved you know, especially in the Catholic church, it was so different back then. Just didn't have a voice. Now, if you went to church and something happened, you would say something Back then you didn't, especially as a woman. Yeah, especially a woman, you know, and this is the 60s and yeah.

Hannah: 16:40

Interesting. After Levine graduated high school, he got involved at a summer job at a small park in Chickpea Mass as a recreation assistant and a month later he was immediately fired and labeled quote an undesirable person to be around children. End quote.

Jess: 16:55

Okay, so second red flag.

Hannah: 16:57

Thank you. During his time at the boarding school and also at seminary, his grades were average at best and he was labeled a person that would need to be consoled a lot in his difficulties and he would need consolation of friends to help him in his troubles. Despite these issues, he was ordained by Bishop Weldon at the Cathedral of St Michael the Archangel in downtown Springfield Mass on May 14th 1966 19.

Jess: 17:21

What were you saying, mom? That's right on State Street, oh, really, right down the road, yeah.

Hannah: 17:26

Ooh. When I read that I was like okay, that's a little too close for comfort.

Jess: 17:30

Yeah, it's just weird to hear these stories that are in your like literal backyard.

Hannah: 17:36

Yeah, it's very disconcerting, especially when you have people that were very close to this. It's very disconcerting. Yeah, bishop Weldon knew quickly that Levine was not going to be an easy priest to manage. He incessantly bothered Weldon about teaching at Cathedral High School, saying he was more than qualified and had excellent rapport with children. With the recommendation to become a priest, people knew that his academics were not up to par to teach.

Hannah: 18:02

He was sent to East Hampton, massachusetts, where, when he did come home where he did not come home on time the pastor locked him out for being late, which then Levine took a rock and broke the window in order to get it. He only lasted three months there and was then sent to Holyoke mass when one of the pastor pastors rules at this church was that they were not allowed to be seated if you missed the blessing, like if you missed the prayer. And Levine arrived after the blessing and so the housekeeper said you cannot join the table. Levine said quote well, if I can't eat, no one will, and dump the whole dinner on the floor. What the hell? He only lasted three months and was then sent to St Catherine of Siena.

Jess: 18:39

So they just pass him around. They don't like fire him, and that can someone else's problem.

Mom: 18:44

after Danny's murder they still continue to move him from place to place into Other parishes. I'm sorry, don't need to jump ahead. No, you're fine, I'm good other parishes and into with unsuspecting parents and their other boys and children and so who knows how many kids have been affected? I've heard an estimate of hundreds really that's crazy.

Jess: 19:12

I've been texting my husband Thank you, are you ever an altar boy? But his family grew up in chickpeas, so I'm wondering if they know. Do you know any goonins?

Jess & Hannah: 19:23

Okay, do you honey. Lucky you, the best one it's right, just kidding.

Hannah: 19:29

I say I'm the best Fitzpatrick. So there you go. So I am getting all this information from a book that I'm reading. It's called the unsolved murder of Danny Croto and the culture of abuse in the Catholic Church Death of an altar boy by E J Fleming. It's not only just about Danny Croto, but it's a lot about how I'll get into it. But the church covering shit up Mm-hmm.

Jess: 19:50

It's Insane one, it still happens. It makes me every church.

Hannah: 19:56

It makes me so sick and, like my mom was saying, the passing around, it's like, oh well, the more of a degree of crappy thing you did, the further they send you along it's. It's awful. He was seen as the priest that could relate to the public which I know mommy kind of touched on, like you, like he was young, irreverent. Yeah, his sermons were full of anti-Vietnam ideas, yes, and politics of the time which Polly for youth was like really cool to us.

Mom: 20:24

It was it. That's the kind of thing you want to hear, although we were never allowed to go to his masses after a while. But yeah, that's appealing if you don't look too deep.

Hannah: 20:35

Yeah, he would sometimes just show up at family's houses to have dinner with them and was once seen in the backyard putting on the grill without being asked. So they literally looked out the window and he's there turning their grill on for dinner. I Mean.

Jess: 20:49

Obviously he wasn't top boundaries. He was grabbing his mom's tits, for Christ's sake, you know so.

Hannah: 20:56

He would take day trips, sometimes lasting a week, with children, inviting them over his place to look at Playboy magazines, going out for ice cream or watching Alfred Hitchcock movies that they cannot watch at home. He was rough housing with kids and being more than helpful with altar boys. People did know something was a little off about him and even Danny's parents felt something was off, but their kids never complained, so they just kept going along with it. More and more people were picking up on the oddity of Levine and soon he was transferred to st Mary's on page Boulevard and Springfield Transfer Transfer the thing is St Mary's.

Mom: 21:31

If you Google map it is not that far from St Cots, mm-hmm. But the information, the way information was transferred, was newspaper and, yeah, there was no social media, there was no Facebook. St Mary's might as well been, you know, in Canada somewhere.

Mom: 21:48

I really, back then, early 70s, the spread of information was it was different and he was, you know, and there was a sigh of relief, but at the time there were, there was a small community of people that were Convinced or thought that he was, he was guilty of killing. Danny, do you want me to kind of talk about? Go for it, I need more wine, okay. So it's hard to talk about it is. It is difficult because I remember when the police came to. Can I go there when the police came to the house?

Hannah: 22:29

If you want to skip ahead, that's.

Mom: 22:30

I don't want to know you, mom, you speak as you will speak, it's fine Okay so when she when she gets there and talk about the, the community of people that were kind of aware of it.

Mom: 22:42

We had two police officers my mother always claimed they were FBI, I don't know that, I just thought they were police officers came to the door on a Saturday morning and it was that was April, right, and I wanted to talk to my brother. We lived very close to where Danny was last seen by someone and there was there was like a pick-up basketball game at the 16-acre school, which I think that was the Mary Martin Elementary School, and they had thought that perhaps my brother and his best friend, who lived next door, had been there, maybe had they seen Danny there and asked a lot of questions. And then they left and they went next door and talked to his best friend. But when they walked in they said to his father World War two vet, tough guy, we want to talk to your son alone. And he said over my dead body, you're talking to my son, yeah you know, and, of course, his best friend he told he told me the exact same story.

Mom: 23:44

You know that my brother, I told them because their kids and there's 12 at the time they, they, didn't know what was going on. It wasn't till afterwards he's called my dad that they had found Danny's body and that they wanted they were trying to like follow up on where he was.

Jess: 24:00

You know activity before you might missing.

Mom: 24:03

Yeah, so there was already at that point in time. You know, did we have a serial killer in the neighborhood? Mm-hmm, was it an accident? I mean, they knew it wasn't these 12-year-old kids. None of them were driving and of course it they said. They said that they couldn't get foot. There's no DNA.

Hannah: 24:20

There's no DNA back then right, yeah, so, and we'll talk about how the police really fucked it up with. Yeah. Yeah, we'll get into that and we'll cut you off for you, good.

Mom: 24:30

No, I'll talk about. I'll talk about this free from newspaper cover up when you get there.

Hannah: 24:35

Even with this move to another church, levine did not stop being a part of the Croto family. On Friday, april 7th, danny left to go spend time with Levine, and his parents received a phone call Later asking if Danny could stay the night. Danny returned the next morning at 9 o'clock. They were not sure how he got back from Chica B, but bunny, his mother, just assumed that Levine gave him a lift. She remembered that Danny looked quote listless and nauseous. He laid around and kept complaining about his stomach, which, my god, hint, hint mom like hint, hint like sexually abused and sexually abused to mm-hmm.

Hannah: 25:08

She also mentioned that he vomited several times, but after dinner he said he's gonna take the bus to the YMCA and he left. The following week was Easter week in the church and also the beginning of fishing season, which Danny was really excited about. I was curious, though, mom, where was the YMCA that he could have been referring to? Do you know?

Mom: 25:27

No, no way. Ymca, I know, was the one that's down on just some straight and spring fail, so that's probably why he was gonna take the bus.

Hannah: 25:33

But still so young taking the bus to the YMCA downtown yeah that does same.

Mom: 25:37

It might have been something, might been another, or the Y could have had a program and one of the junior high. Schools or something yeah.

Hannah: 25:45

I don't know. The day before he was reported missing he was seen around the neighborhood, mm-hmm and in different parts in Springfield. When Danny did not get home that night they checked if Danny's fishing gear was there and checked nearby ponds and streams because they thought maybe he wanted fish Cuz he was so excited about it. His mother made calls, including to Levine, but he said he had not seen Danny. At 1115 Danny's parents called Springfield police reporting Danny missing, but police would not file a report until he was missing 12 hours.

Jess: 26:13

Of course, which we all know now. That's bullshit. It is bullshit.

Hannah: 26:17

I don't have to wait, especially if it's a kid, because she was furious because she's like he's only a kid, like he's too young, like when you have an adult missing, like okay, they're an adult, mm-hmm, but this kid's like so young, he's barely a teenager. Like why can't you just put the report in Lazy, especially when there's no cell phones, no way to connect? Levine called back around midnight saying that they should also call the chick at the police, and which I thought was Suspicious.

Hannah: 26:43

Yeah much, much and the report was not filed until 2 11 am. His parents could not sleep. Obviously they were just hoping that their son would come home. The whole neighborhood was finding out about Danny missing and parents started making calls and kids took their bikes around the neighborhood to try to help. Around 9 o'clock Dan's brother gathered some of his friends to bike to the spot where he and Danny and Levine Used to fish underneath the bridge. Once they got there, that's when they were greeted by the fire trucks, ambulances and police cars and they returned away and told to go home.

Hannah: 27:13

The body of Danny Croto have been found. The Croto's were told that their son was dead and they wanted Danny's parents to come down to police headquarters. Danny's father, carl, requested that they make a stop at Levine's parish. God, here we go. Levine asked if they want him to come along and Carl was grateful for the company. Oh my god. Levine sat in the questioning with them, being quiet and offering nothing, and when it came time for them to identify the body, levine interrupted and said quote no, no, no, let him stay here. All identify the body.

Hannah: 27:49

So he's like inserting himself into the investigation, saying yeah, and he's being a perv because he wants to see what he did.

Mom: 27:55

Oh, now he is evil personified. He is just an evil. Evil was an evil person sounds like it.

Hannah: 28:07

Levine told Danny's parents to make sure it was a closed casket and even though his parents wanted to be open, he said to them quote, you don't want to see Danny like that and quote.

Jess: 28:16

So let's let the guy who killed him just control everything about what happens. I'm sure that's how they feel now, like, oh I would be, livid Levine would be dead. Sorry, I'm sure he is right, he died Okay.

Hannah: 28:30

Oh wait, but please don't explain, because that will get to the next episode.

Jess & Hannah: 28:34

Okay, that's good shit, okay.

Hannah: 28:37

The blood spotter shows that Danny fought for his life which good for him. Kid under the bridge shows the initial fight, and they were the remarks in the dirt that showed that his body Was dragged feet first to the water's edge, where then Danny received a second beating. Danny was most likely incapacitated at the original spot and was near death before he received the second beating. A Fist-sized rock was found covered in blood with clumps of hair on it. Tire marks were found at the scene, but the tire prints were one of many mistakes made by law enforcement. Between Springfield chicka-bee and the DA's office it was a pissing battle of who had the right over this case. The casts that were made of the tire treads were done by inexperienced people on the chicka-bee force, so that so that was not done properly.

Jess: 29:18

Mm-hmm.

Hannah: 29:19

And when the physical evidence was photographed, catalogued and collected Items, including the rock that had hair samples on it, removed by state police and never seen again. So who do you think had control over those missing items?

Jess: 29:32

I'm guessing that Irish Catholics?

Hannah: 29:37

The autopsy was not done by experienced people either, but it was determined that this was a homicide oh shit and that Danny was murdered. Danny had multiple lacerations, a massive skull fracture that drove pieces of bone into his brain. His jaw was split in half and fractures of this magnitude they said would be more like a V result of an event like a car accident or plane crash Holy shit. So he beat. This was rage. Yeah, danny had also been strangled, and Danny's alcohol level was point 18 percent, which was almost double the 1972 legal limit.

Jess: 30:08

So they were drinking Mm-hmm tried to do whatever to him. Yeah, he fought back and Then he killed him.

Hannah: 30:16

That's my guess. So, mom, you had mentioned to me that you had heard that there was one time Levine tried picking him up from school and Danny didn't want to go with him.

Mom: 30:25

Yeah, I had heard that he was at school and Levine's car was outside and daddy broke down in front of one of the other kids. That's what I don't want to go, when they simply don't go. And he's kind of like. You know he was 12 years old.

Jess: 30:40

Yeah, priest, mm-hmm.

Mom: 30:41

What was he? What was he gonna say? I mean, he was powerless, he was a victim in so many ways.

Jess: 30:48

Well, and it's not like you tell the priest no right, or you know cuz there's the men of God you know, they are your ticket to heaven, honey.

Hannah: 30:58

At least that's how they thought Danny was waked. Oh sorry, just miss.

Jess: 31:03

I was just gonna say I'll agree to disagree.

Hannah: 31:06

Danny was waked that morning and Levine told Danny's aunt who had come from California to convince his parents to have a closed casket, which she ended up convincing them. Mm-hmm, this was interesting. Uh, franciscan fryer named Barnabas Keck, do you know him, mom? No, showed up to the wake and showed great grief by wailing and crying at the casket. Nobody knew who he was and it was peculiar that he was there. Come to find out he was Levine's confessor and he probably knew all of what happened.

Jess: 31:37

Oh, break my heart for Barnabas.

Hannah: 31:41

That's gotta be tough. Something I didn't put in here is that I don't know if it was the investigators or whatever, but they visited Barnabas and he had a like a Quirkboard behind his desk and the only thing that was up there was Danny. Like the from the Republican is the Danny's Obituary or the case or whatever he's carrying this around, but since it was confession, he couldn't say anything.

Jess: 32:08

I don't agree with that the sprinkler newspaper.

Mom: 32:10

Mm-hmm did carry a lot of stories about the investigation and I haven't I'm really good authority. At one point they were putting a Newspaper article and saying that Levine was being questioned. It was one of the top suspects, it's from the beginning got a hold of it, that information and what. This was what was told, and I got it from my mother because she my mother was really good about giving us information To keep us safe.

Mom: 32:44

Yeah and she said that ended up on the composing room floor. That never made it and it was at the the orders of the bishop and, I'll be honest, you personally. When I heard that, I looked at her, looked at my dad and I said I will never, go to the Catholic Church again Ever. I said the church is full of hypocrites. Mm-hmm now not just Catholic Church right.

Jess: 33:09

Yeah, but I think every organized religion has that, but as a 15 year old girl.

Mom: 33:16

I never went. I did not step foot into a Catholic Church for about eight years and never attended one again.

Hannah: 33:21

Hmm, sometime in the afternoon one of Dan's brothers answered the phone. After saying hello a couple times, he finally heard a familiar voice say quote we're sorry for what happened to Danny. He saw something behind the circle he shouldn't have seen. It was an accident. And quote what. They asked who it was a couple times with the line went dead. Danny's brothers ended up admitting to being victims of Valor Levine.

Mom: 33:43

Hmm.

Jess: 33:45

Levine was acting strangely in the weeks after no did you want so not just Danny, his brothers as well a lot of the Young men that I knew my age were all altar boys and were victims.

Mom: 33:58

Oh, my god years years later not that many years, but years later one of those young men killed himself. Now it was never said that it was a result of the physical abuse, but I mean he was a victim. They knew he was a victim and he did commit suicide, but that I think the community always felt it.

Jess: 34:20

Yeah, we can connect the dots. I'm sure he experienced a lot of a Lot of stuff after that, levine was acting strangely.

Hannah: 34:29

In the weeks after Danny was found there should have been a search warrant issued for Levine's home and rectory Quarters, but it is speculative that the church had had a hand in that and that not happening. Hmm, when the investigators asked the Croto family if the phone call that was made about the circle could have been Levine, the brother that answered the phone connected the dots and knew it was Levine. So he thought it sounded familiar but he just did not connect to that. It was the priest. It's grieving.

Mom: 34:52

Yeah.

Hannah: 34:53

It was grieving.

Mom: 34:54

I can't even imagine what that family went through. I mean those shockwaves of that, just as a mom I, just that just overwhelms me to even think about that.

Jess: 35:05

I think that there would have to be some guilt and feeling responsible because they Encouraged him to hang out with Levine, correct?

Hannah: 35:13

If you also think about how many kids she had. Right, and you're like this priest wants to spend time with my boys. He is taking them off my hands Like I know they're gonna be safe with a man of God and then this happens.

Jess: 35:25

Well, and it's similar. I mean not similar, but we talked about it a little during Lewis Lent, who used the church to get close to, yeah, single moms and to be okay with driving kids around and it's, it's like the perfect opportunity for people right douche canoes like this to take advantage of Families and kids makes me sick.

Mom: 35:51

It's why so many churches now you have to be quarried and everything else to where I wish children. But you know, hannah and I saw this even in a non-Catholic church that we were, there was a young man, got married and and they moved away, but he lost his own kids. He's in jail.

Hannah: 36:08

No, he was he was a youth, a youth coordinator yes, youth pastor. I remember being with him, him wanting me on the Volleyball team, him being a part of my Bible classes and then, when they had moved, he went to a Christian school and was molesting children and then he ended up in jail. So it's. And then, of course, my mom has to have the tough conversation with her grown adult children.

Hannah: 36:32

Like was there something happening I didn't know and, granted, we were very lucky that this wasn't happening to us, but it hits too close to home.

Jess: 36:40

Yeah, I mean I've mentioned the Mormon church obviously a lot, but there's even coverup of sexual abuse from bishops and other people that are in a power of authority that take advantage, and then the church, whether it be Mormon Catholic. I've even found a book about the Amish community where sexual abuse takes place and they just try to cover it all up. It's ridiculous.

Mom: 37:04

It's so important to teach our children when they say no means no. No means no, just like you teach your daughters when they say no means no and to maybe always be. I think that's why for me and I probably drove my kids crazy as they became teenagers I wouldn't, I wouldn't. I was single mom, I wouldn't date because I would never bring a man into my home, and I think a lot of that is some of what happened. So close to home, yeah, and even though obviously my family was not impacted the way his family was.

Jess: 37:39

I don't want to put that, but it was still in your neighborhood. It was With three streets. Yeah, three, four streets over.

Mom: 37:46

Three streets over. I checked, but I was overprotective and it drove my kids crazy Sometimes that when they would be going to do something, guess who volunteered to drive. I did, mm-hmm, I did.

Jess & Hannah: 37:58

You're a little mama bear.

Mom: 38:00

School all nighters Taking care of your cubs Church all nighters. Guess who's there? You're the chaperone Because you don't know. So I think when this incident came up of this coach and youth coordinator after he moved away, we immediately you know everyone in the church was like well, wait a minute, you were, you know, a lot of times you were in his car, or you were in his car and Over his home, over his house, lovely wife, he had an autistic son. Yep, there's no way of knowing. Yep, no, that's why you have to be Sometimes.

Mom: 38:38

Be a very mama bear yeah.

Jess: 38:41

Yeah, rightfully so.

Hannah: 38:44

In June, father Leo E O'Neill stopped at the Croto home. Do you know that name, mom? Yeah, yes, I do you do?

Mom: 38:51

Okay, he came in after he actually ended up becoming fish about one point.

Hannah: 38:58

I think I mentioned that. Yes, he was said to be white as a ghost when he talked to Carl and he spoke of the abuse that happened against his children and he did think that Levine killed his son. A week later, O'Neill returned and gave Carl a lot of cash more than $700, which would probably be around $5,000 today. He said the church was sending them to visit his wife's family in California and he thought it might be good if they got away for a while.

Jess: 39:25

What the?

Hannah: 39:26

fuck. Hmm, that's not the worst of it, oh my God. So we're wondering where the church got the money right A month later, james Egan, do you know James Egan mom? No, I don't. He was the lawyer for the diocese that showed up to the Croto home and asked them what they wanted or if there's anything they needed. Carl was insulted and then Egan said if there's anything they decided they needed to let them know, and the Crotos would not hear from the diocese ever again.

Jess & Hannah: 39:53

Ew, so to buy their silence.

Jess: 39:54

Yep, they're buying in a month, ugh.

Jess & Hannah: 39:56

Yep.

Hannah: 39:57

Ugh, mom, you'll appreciate this. Danny's mom looked for any photos she had of Levine and made sure to shred the mom, so she had no memory of this man that took her baby away.

Jess: 40:07

Burn it. I would have done a witches curse Where's the Putt?

Hannah: 40:13

numbs Where's the Putt numbs Right?

Jess: 40:15

it's fucking Putt numbs. They could be good for something.

Mom: 40:19

You know, I think there's. This is a terrible thing to say publicly, but I think as a mother, that would have been justifiable homicide. Oh yeah, I really think if someone hurt my kids that it would. They would be destroyed. I would not be able to forgive them for that. You would be hurt back because 12 years old, I mean. It's horrific, it's really horrific.

Hannah: 40:43

It's haunting you know, Since there was not enough evidence of interest in the case, it slowly sizzled and remained in a storage locker unsolved for 20 years.

Jess: 40:52

Are you kidding me? 20 years.

Mom: 40:56

I think it's what's his brother's, a couple of his brothers that really kind of pushed it to the forefront with an recent memory.

Hannah: 41:06

So because of this, we're going to kind of go into like fucking awfulness of the diocese, come back a little bit into Levine, and then we'll have to save the rest for another episode. Okay, so this was not the first time the church covered up their sins. In 1922, the Vatican enacted quote crime of solicitation, which was prohibiting even public mention of abuse. Accused priests were ordered to be immediately absolved Right, let's forgive you and sent on a pious pilgrimage as their penance, and the crime was ordered to be stored in the secret archives as strictly confidential. That's such bullshit.

Hannah: 41:43

In Springfield, these secret archives were hidden inside three locked cabinets in a vault buried in the regular archives. So there's documentation of all this, oh God. The secret archives contain files labeled quote unnatural involvements, and that could be a thing from alcohol to drugs, to pornography and even pregnancies. Folders for sexual abuse were titled quote unusual patterns. Obviously this goes above and beyond Springfield, massachusetts, and here are a couple of stories. There were letters found between two priests that were abusers and they would send letters to each other about their activities. Are you serious? I am not going to read or say what I read, because they do talk about it in there, because I literally started getting sick because of it, because it bothered me so bad.

Jess: 42:29

Like I was like. So it was like two friends joking about their sexual escapades with children. Awesome At one point.

Mom: 42:36

There was reportedly a ring of priests this was later that I had heard someone I know had mentioned that there was some. I can't get into it because it's not my story to tell, but there were priests that actually passed these young victims around.

Jess: 42:56

So sex trafficking basically, exactly, exactly. This hurts my heart, so bad.

Hannah: 43:03

In Louisiana in the 1980s, a group of parents suspected their priests of abusing their children. They asked him and he admitted to it and said that he needed help and they paid for his therapy sessions. What? And they did not report him To pay for castration.

Jess: 43:20

I mean, you don't need to pay for that, let's get a knife right now.

Hannah: 43:24

We should send them to those those. Why am I blanking? I just did the episode on it. I meant the mental institutions. Oh my God, in 1976, father McGuire Mom, do you know who Father McGuire is yes, I do who also became a future bishop in Springfield, was told by a dad that his son was being molested by a priest that McGuire knew was an abuser. But McGuire said quote I'm sure it was just horseplay and quote.

Jess: 43:49

Maybe foreplay, not horseplay? What the fuck.

Hannah: 43:53

There is a good documentary called the Keepers on Netflix. Have you seen it? No, have you watched it Me and Rob watched it. It's amazing. So it is about these adults who who were students at this school in Baltimore in 1969, where a nun was murdered for knowing too much about the abuse happening by the priest. It's, it's really good. So I had to watch. Recommend if anyone wants to watch that. What streaming?

Jess: 44:16

Netflix, oh, netflix, ok, thank you the.

Hannah: 44:18

Keepers on Netflix 1991, shelburne Falls, massachusetts. A family accused their priest of abuse and of course we know it is because, they moved him.

Mom: 44:30

They moved him again.

Jess & Hannah: 44:31

Was it, levine it's.

Jess: 44:32

Levine.

Hannah: 44:34

No way On October 19.

Mom: 44:37

This is 1991. So we're talking about almost 20 years later, 20 years later you still had him. So you know someone with that kind of predilection.

Jess: 44:47

He hasn't stopped, right, he's not going to stop. Why would he stop? He didn't get caught with murder.

Mom: 44:52

They were just sending him to places where he has new victims.

Hannah: 44:56

On October 9.

Mom: 44:57

I'm sorry.

Hannah: 44:58

No, it's OK, You're fine. On October 19, 1991, greenfield, massachusetts police issued an arrest warrant due to statements given by three boys. Finally, levine was arrested. No, he became, damn it. Levine was arrested and he became the first priest in Western Massachusetts history charged with child sexual assault. He was put on bail of $10,000 but, oddly, not assigned a die-seasoned attorney, which I thought was interesting. And we're going to stop our story there Until next time.

Jess: 45:26

What the hell I need to know this guy is evil, evil.

Hannah: 45:32

I will tell you, I've been going through this book so slowly, like I would call my mom, probably like every 20 pages asking her questions, and then I had to put it away because it was making me so sick. Well, especially if it gets descriptive, very, oh, like it still makes me want to want. But you know what I'm, I'm very, I feel very humbled to be able to tell Danny. Yeah, because it's just, it's, it's horrifying, it's horrifying. The cover ups, I think, is what just makes me the maddest.

Jess: 46:02

Well, and this this book is is good for, that is, to bring awareness to what has been going on and probably what continues to go on, and that keeps getting covered up and, oh, it breaks my heart, for who knows how many victims this douche has.

Hannah: 46:20

But I, from what I read in this book, the parents were very willing to be a part of it and tell their son's story, which I think is really important, and yeah, to her hopes that it doesn't happen to any other family.

Jess: 46:34

Will you come back for the next?

Hannah: 46:36

episode mom, I'll try, she'll try.

Jess: 46:40

Good, we love having you here.

Mom: 46:41

Thank you so much for inviting me.

Hannah: 46:43

Well, thank you, mom, for putting your two sons in it. I made it unfortunately more real, but it gave us insight to that time, which was helpful.

Mom: 46:52

Anything that helps, somebody listens and you think you know, you gotta say something. Yeah, yeah, I say something trust your judgment.

Jess: 47:00

Yep, I always trust your gut.

Mom: 47:02

Yeah, teach your kids. No means no. No Communication open with your kids, so something weird is happening and they tell you.

Jess: 47:11

Regardless, leave them. If they are a man of God or not, yep, no matter, I think that, a lot of those.

Mom: 47:18

I Think the way that way of thinking about it has has changed a lot in a lot of the churches. Yeah, I think we see we understand that they're only man and their fallible. I don't, I don't think unless you look at like the FLDS or something, oh, we're getting, we're gonna talk about.

Mom: 47:40

I've been watching a lot about the FLDS. I think there is religious Abuse, mm-hmm and I think, walking away from the Calvary Church because of that, I I think that my upbringing, mm-hmm, allow me to get into other situations, yeah, with pastors that were Dictators and possibly abusive until. But as an adult, I can pull myself out of those situations, but it kind of sets you up for it. So you, you take all that with you.

Jess: 48:11

So, yeah, well, and I I mean I've shared a lot about my Mormon upbringing and, thank God, I didn't experience anything. Mm-hmm like this. But I was telling these guys it wasn't until I watched Handmaid's tail. When there's that part where the higher guy up in the religion, mm-hmm, and the guy that one of the upper guys are in the limo and Trying to convince you know, to have their wives involved in the ceremony watching their husband's fuck another woman. I remember that and he says they're holding them down.

Jess: 48:46

Yeah and he says well, make them be a part of the ceremony. Yeah, like. Well. How would we convince that they were inventing?

Mom: 48:53

a religion exactly.

Jess: 48:54

and then they're like, just say that it was commanded by God, yeah, and my yep Mind was blown because I'm like, oh my god, all of this makes sense now, like Because they're, they're men, they're human, they have faults and they can say they're men of God, all that they want.

Mom: 49:11

But yeah, that's a way to control people. I had PTSD. After watching some of the handmaids tell I had my own PTSD.

Jess: 49:19

So, yeah. Thanks for the episode and the cliffhanger you know you're welcome.

Hannah: 49:25

He done to me, I know true.

Mom: 49:28

It's a tough one. Kids, kids and pets, elger abuse, anything like that. That's the kind of stuff that I can't really talk about it and that's why this stuff can't go on is if you don't talk about it and, like I said, I want I sit he hand out. Originally I said I would like to come on and share my experience, but out of total respect for his family.

Hannah: 49:49

Yeah, I don't want to sound Um, I don't want to sound any which way, but I feel like I'm like close to Danny in a lot of ways after doing all this research. Mm-hmm and I know it sounds weird because this kid was way before my time yeah, but it's, I feel very close to the case in a lot of ways. So it's, it's, it's good.

Mom: 50:08

It's good.

Hannah: 50:08

that needs to be told it needs to be because for so long this poor child went through this darkness by himself.

Mom: 50:15

I know and thank you for tackling such a tough subject. Well, thank you for bringing it to our attention.

Jess: 50:21

Yes, and this won't be the only episode on religious trauma.

Hannah: 50:25

Oh no.

Jess: 50:26

We're just getting started.

Hannah: 50:28

I'll beat that Please do Thanks Mom, Thank you for joining us. Thank you, Hannah. Thanks for joining the show.

Jess: 50:38

Yes, and don't be a douche canoe. Yes, don't be a douche canoe.

Hannah: 50:41

And always remember no means no, Say something, yes, exactly.

Jess & Hannah: 50:47

Bye, bye, bye.

Hannah: 50:49

Thanks for listening today. The show wouldn't be possible without our amazing producer and editor, Rob Fitzpatrick, who works tirelessly behind the scenes to bring you the best content and a special thanks to Tyga Soundprod for providing the captivating intro music.

Jess: 51:03

Cinematic Intro 24.

Hannah: 51:05

And of course we can't forget the hauntingly beautiful outro music, rhino's Theme composed by Kevin MacLeod, if you enjoyed today's episode.

Jess: 51:13

Make sure to leave a rating and review on your favorite podcast platforms like Spotify, apple and YouTube.

Jess & Hannah: 51:20

Your feedback means the world to us.

Hannah: 51:23

Also, be sure to follow us on Instagram for behind the scenes glimpses, updates and more thrilling content. You can find us at Wicked Wandering's Podcast.

Jess: 51:31

Thank you so much for listening and being part of our Wicked Wandering's community.

Jess & Hannah: 51:36

We appreciate each and every one of you Stay curious, keep exploring and always remember to keep on wandering. Wicked Wandering's Podcast.