Hannah: 0:00

I did want to ask. Oppose something to the ladies here. Yes, Do we know about Wade Wilson?

Jess: 0:06

No, who's Wade Wilson?

Hannah: 0:09

The guy that just got convicted in trial and got death penalty. No, book talk is all about him right now because there's half the women that are like, oh my God, he's the sexiest thing ever. People are like what's wrong with you? He killed people. No, what.

Courtney: 0:28

I mean, how many women reach out to serial? Killers in jail a lot. That's why there's a whole tiktok environment for them. Have you ever seen? It looks like they're dating profiles. They're like and I'm located in missouri, I want someone who drives a tan volkswagen bug you guys don't know about this guy.

Hannah: 0:41

Like women are split, like they're like oh my god, yes, sexy book talk and people are like he killed people. Like we can read all the dark romance we want, but this is not okay, ladies he gives me like um, what's that show peaky blinders vibes the haircut.

Rob: 0:57

You know what that comes from women with no excitement in their life. Maybe I just have to say looks aren't everything okay.

Jess: 0:59

The guy, obviously, I mean if he's gonna. You know what that comes from? Women with no excitement in their life, maybe.

Hannah: 1:06

I just have to say looks aren't everything. The guy obviously has some issues.

Jess: 1:10

I mean if he's going to slit your throat while he's fucking you.

Courtney: 1:12

No, certainly they don't love him for his trust.

Hannah: 1:14

No, but yeah, he got the death penalty Good.

Rob: 1:19

Yeah, so he'll be alive for another 20 years.

Courtney: 1:22

Especially if the people on TikTok can vote.

Hannah: 1:25

Automatic appeals. Because there are women on there that are like, listen, we read our spicy books, we read about the bad guys. I get it. Right, haunting Adeline, I get it, but ladies, it's a fantasy. This man actually killed women, ran over their bodies until they were string cheese. You know what? It's not okay. I just was curious, because all of us like a little splice in our life, ladies.

Courtney: 1:50

So what denied?

Jess: 1:53

I don't know who you're talking I don't know what you're talking about.

Rob: 1:56

I'm vanilla aren't you the one that drove through a red light when you were listening to a spicy?

Courtney: 2:01

yeah out that story courtesy of our dinner date.

Jess: 2:07

I was. I was distracted by whatever was going on in that book.

Hannah: 2:11

My imagination is my best friend, oh, my goodness.

Courtney: 2:16

Okay, hi, I'm Jess and I'm Hannah.

Hannah: 2:36

Join us as we delve into true crime, paranormal encounters and all things spooky. So grab your flashlight and get ready to wander into the darkness with us. This is Wicked Wanderings. Hi Jess, Hi Hannah.

Jess: 3:05

Hi Rob, Hi Hannah, Hi Rob, Hi Hannah. You better keep that in.

Hannah: 3:11

Hi Courtney, hi Hannah Courtney's joining us again Yay.

Rob: 3:16

Weren't you here last week?

Courtney: 3:18

I was, I had so much fun last week. Yeah, I had to come back Calling us out again.

Hannah: 3:25

I'm going to pose a question. Yes, respond as you feel, always do. What is it you think of when you hear the word farm Animals Okay.

Rob: 3:37

Eggs.

Jess: 3:38

Yeah, I mean, there's a body farm. Yeah, those are kind of interesting Were they people who donate their bodies for science and then they put them in various places and temperatures to see how the body reacts.

Hannah: 3:51

When I posed this question, I was like oh flowers, old McDonald Fields of grain, sunrises, Not body farm. Have you ever been?

Jess: 4:02

to a farm. It's like cow shit.

Rob: 4:04

Do you even listen to this podcast?

Hannah: 4:06

I do, but I don't know. I guess I was thinking like Happiness yeah. Like have a country man you know, on a tractor. On a tractor, yeah, cowboy hat yeah.

Jess: 4:17

Yeah.

Hannah: 4:17

Have you ever seen that show where, like the cowboys, are trying to get lives and shit the farmers? Nope. Seven brides for seven brothers no, not that one.

Jess: 4:30

Oh my gosh, that's so sexist. Speaking of sexist, my this has nothing to do with it, but my mom grew up on a dairy farm and that farm was the first time I saw a playboy in my life. My cousin found it and we're sitting in one of the cow things looking at playboy stop.

Courtney: 4:52

I'm surprised your answer when she said farm wasn't porn. Yeah, yeah, right, I mean I'm not all, or dairy right?

Hannah: 4:59

dairy dairy her mom grew up on a dairy farm why was dairy not her first thought it?

Courtney: 5:02

It was just bodies.

Hannah: 5:03

When was your first time seeing a body? Courtney Playboy.

Courtney: 5:07

I don't even know. I was like 10. I don't think I've ever seen one in real life, really, yeah, I don't think I've ever seen a Playboy magazine in real life.

Hannah: 5:16

Okay, I have one more question before I start. Are you sure? Yes, okay. Has anyone read the book the Jungle by Upton Sinclair? A very long time ago. No, do you remember what it's about?

Courtney: 5:26

Not at all. I think it was one of those ones that was required.

Hannah: 5:29

Yes, I never remember anything when it was required. It was about that meatpacking plant in Chicago.

Courtney: 5:36

I think I blacked it out.

Hannah: 5:36

Okay, just keep that on the back of your mind for this episode.

Jess: 5:47

That's probably going to be a two for a three for because it's a lot.

Hannah: 5:50

Okay, I know where this is going. So if you're eating or have eaten recently, especially a hot dog, or ground beef.

Jess: 5:54

Yeah, just uh or or bacon or sausage, finish eating and then come back.

Hannah: 6:00

Yeah, because uh this is your warning if you throw up? I don't want to hear about it.

Jess: 6:04

I do send us a message on our buzzsprout yeah, send us a text message.

Rob: 6:10

Uh link is in the show notes this is the story of robert picton major douche canoe?

Hannah: 6:19

yes, the first episode's gonna be a lot about his life growing up, so I'm not really gonna get into the murderous side yet, but it's gonna be a lot of like his childhood.

Jess: 6:30

I think this stuff is important, it is important?

Hannah: 6:33

I think it is too, because we need a background on who he is. So, speaking from mental health perspective, ladies all of us in the mental health field I want your perspective and your input. He's a sick fuck. He is louise and leonard picton had three children david, robert and linda. They owned lf picton ranch, poultry and pigs. Great name right sounds awful to me, but that's personal if it has poultry and pigs I can't even hear you I mean I'm, I'm a little like scared.

Jess: 7:06

Now I mean, never mind, just move on do you feel salted?

Hannah: 7:13

I don't even know what to think right now all right, it used to be a beautiful place, abundant with salmon in the river and berry bushes for picking. The father, leonard, was born. Born in England and his family immigrated to Canada. The people that knew him described him as lazy with no drive.

Jess: 7:32

I would never want to be described as that I'm just saying Lazy with no drive, yeah.

Hannah: 7:39

He married Louise, who was 16 years younger than him. The book On the Farm by Stevie Cameron goes into detail about how this woman was not your standard beauty, years younger than him. The book on the farm by stevie cameron goes into detail about how this woman was not your standard beauty. I recommend the book 100 pages so far, it's very thorough. Oh okay, um, it's not that I don't recommend, but just go in knowing you're gonna get every single fucking detail which is a bad thing.

Hannah: 8:01

All the tea, yes so, yeah, the book had described how she wasn't your standard beauty, but I'm not going to go into detail, because why kick a sister when she's down? Because he really went to detail. The pictons were not known for their cleanliness or housekeeping. They let the animals track in and out of the house, gross, the kids bathed once a week and there were shacks placed around the property. Will Willie actually had an aversion to water, which I thought was interesting, which makes me think of Courtney, our autistic client.

Courtney: 8:30

A lot of them don't like water, or they do, or they love it too much. They really love water. They really don't.

Hannah: 8:36

Dirt covered the counters, a mattress on the floor was the furniture in the living room and mom had the only key to the locks on the cupboards. Stories also circled of Willie suffering abuse at the hand of his father. This does not sound like a great nurturing place to grow up. If you ask me, this sounds like a DCF call.

Courtney: 8:53

Yeah, second Second thought.

Hannah: 8:56

Third, with this case I'm going to refer to Robert by either Robert or Willie. It is the same person, so everybody knows how do you get from Robert to to willie? Willie was his middle name. Oh okay, yeah, I think william was it. So they called him willie a lot, but the book refers him to both. Was he a junior? No, no, because his dad was leonard. So yeah, I don't know. Willie was not doing well in school. He did not score appropriately on the testing, so he was held back and retested. The teachers did say that the tests were made for more city schools and not the rural areas, where a lot of these students had other priorities, like their family farms. His parents also were not the type to read him a story before bed. Because of his low scores, willie was placed in special education and was encouraged to pick a trade rather than have to complete any higher education.

Hannah: 9:42

When was this 60s Okay, makes sense 60. This 60s Okay Makes sense 60s, 70s. Around the Picton farm. Their neighbors were doctor kids. The Pictons lived next door to the asylum for the mentally ill where the doctor's homes were on site. The asylum got so large it was its own city. Patient labor was used for farming and cow milking. Patients could be seen everywhere and some even worked on the Picton farm and this kind of brought to mind for me, like what did this do for Willie's mental health? I'm all for like having kids see everybody, but I mean I think seeing that as a young kid may not have always been.

Courtney: 10:18

Right with his own struggles as well, too.

Hannah: 10:21

Some interesting facts and tales about Willie that have been shared are he would hide and dug out pig carcasses if people were mad at him. I'm sorry. What so like if he found out like his parents were mad at him, like he would go into like a pig carcass and hide. I mean, that's not my first choice, but he didn't care about smelling at all True.

Courtney: 10:42

If you're really hiding from other people, it it's not a bad place to hide. No one's coming in for you.

Hannah: 10:47

They just made me think of like Star Wars, when he had, to like, kill the animal, oh, the animal to be born, mm-hmm, to be born.

Hannah: 10:57

There was also a time when he saved up money to buy a calf. He wanted to keep it forever and it was going to be his responsibility and his best friend. One day he looked for the calf and so he asked where it went, because he couldn't find it. His parents said maybe it got out. But Willie knew he locked the gate behind it. They told him to check the barn and sure enough, it was strung up in the barn dead.

Courtney: 11:17

Terrible, wow, terrible. And so they killed it and they're like oh, sorry, sorry, we'll get you a new one. I mean, if it were me, I would have been like you, just ate him but making it.

Jess: 11:34

I'm just kidding, cows are friends so, and sometimes food, but like you could see, like all this stuff starting to add up, he's traumatized. Yeah, it sounds like his parents were fucked up.

Hannah: 11:38

yeah, 1963 the pictons moved to dominion road, coquitlam, that's how you say it.

Jess: 11:46

And they're in Canada, right, yeah, okay.

Hannah: 11:48

Coquitlam was expanding so they took the Picton land for highways and housing developments and they made them move. So this was apparently a thing. So they had their house picked up and resettled onto a different piece of property. Willie's sister did not move with them but went to go live with family to get away, because she freaking couldn't stand it anymore and it was probably the best thing she ever did probably I would have done the same same the pictons wanted to keep raising livestock so they made a business b and c lockers.

Hannah: 12:14

Interesting fact back then people didn't have massive freezers so they would just go get their meat every week or every day and they would go to a place like the Pictons and they'd order what they want and just take it home. So the Pictons ended up ordering these huge-ass freezers to keep all of the meat in, keep it stocked.

Rob: 12:32

I don't like where this is going, no me neither.

Jess: 12:34

I was just about to say that I'm glad we ate before this episode.

Hannah: 12:39

Pictons had around 700 pigs and 100 chickens. The boys would start missing school and helping more with the business. Willie quit school at the age of 14. They wanted him to help slaughter the pigs, but he did not want to do it, which I thought was interesting. He eventually agreed to be an apprentice and learned to be a meat cutter I really don't like where this is going well, normally I feel like a serial killers are like fuck yeah, I want to kill, right, that's what I don't

Courtney: 13:07

but they're looking at the nature versus nurture piece too. I mean, if it was really the environment, maybe he didn't always have that natural inclination, maybe it was just the environment kind of forced him into it exactly his brother stayed in school a while longer, but he was the trouble.

Hannah: 13:23

One night the the brother, david, was driving home and was involved in a hit and run near the house. He had hit a local boy on one of the roads near the house and it did not remain on scene. He went home frantic and his father told him to go to the local mechanic and get the car fixed. The mother went, found the boy, dragged him to the edge of the road and tossed him down the embankment. When david got to the mechanic, the mechanic was questioning why he wanted the dent and paint fixed when the rest of the vehicle looked like shit. I mean valid point.

Courtney: 13:54

Screams guilty.

Hannah: 13:55

Right, because that's how the Picktons were. They didn't care how anything worked. Like why this dent and why this part of the paint. So, anyways, the next day came and the mechanic heard on his radio about the hit and run and he was like oh my God.

Rob: 14:09

I know it was them.

Hannah: 14:11

So that's how the police ended up being contacted and going to the Pickton farm. Dave goes to trial, but he has to happen in juvenile court and he is charged with failing to remain at the scene and convicted on December 19, 1967. All he got was basically a slap on the wrist. He was placed on indefinite probation and his driver's license was suspended until 21. Even though the kid died, the coroner and he left Right the coroner released that the local boy did not die from the crash but from drowning in two feet of brown water.

Courtney: 14:40

So where's the mom's murder charge? Where's the mom?

Hannah: 14:43

Yeah, now they're not in the world Because they didn't know. Wow, terrible, yep. So this is another thing that Willie probably saw heard normalized Mm-hmm. You get away with murder, literally, literally.

Rob: 14:58

Murder.

Jess: 15:00

Your voice isn't deep enough.

Hannah: 15:04

Murder, murder. The Pictons still used labor from the specialty schools New Westminster Woodland School for mentally and physically disabled kids. Willie would pick up the kids and drop them off. He would time the drop-offs and he would go through the trash to get the half-eaten meals out of the dumpster. He would then bring them home and his mother would just cut off the bad parts and he would eat them. That's so sad yeah.

Jess: 15:26

I mean resourceful is what I'm hearing, but sad, it is sad.

Courtney: 15:41

When he girls in the hospital flashing him which he never reported to his mother, which I thought was interesting too.

Hannah: 15:44

Why are they flashing him? It seems far there's a nasty looking boy. Let's show him our titties. He's stealing our garbage. He needs boobs. I don't know. I bet we could make his day, but I I saw all these peculiar things happening to him throughout his life and I was like. This probably adds to it.

Hannah: 15:55

This probably had no idea what normal was willie described his relationship with his mom as two peas in a pod, which I thought was interesting. When she was dying, he would help her bathe and change her. She was hard on willie and it showed in things like her will. This is interesting. The father did die first, which wasn't a bad thing, because he an asshole, which meant his will was null and void, since everything went to the mother. The mother's will was different and very odd. She put strict controls on Willie's portion. He got $20,000 lump sum but no more from the estate until he stayed on the farm until he was 40. So he was stuck asking his siblings for money and they did not have to live on the farm like he had to, and his siblings were in charge of his trust.

Jess: 16:41

Why, I don't know. Probably not responsible, or she didn't think he was responsible, but like, why Willie, why not?

Courtney: 16:49

I don't know, they had a special bond.

Hannah: 16:53

I think it's weird.

Jess: 16:54

It is weird, but I'm just thinking. I'm trying to think of why. Why would she do that? Is she trying to make sure he's taken care of or not taken care of?

Hannah: 17:03

Weird way to take care of him. Because he could get so when they were talking about all the different properties that they owned in the businesses, it sounded like he was able to get interest on the trust he had, but he had to ask his siblings for it.

Jess: 17:19

Which I feel like that's so degrading. Well, yeah, it makes me think that she didn't think he was very capable, yeah, of taking care of himself willie was mad, obviously, but kept up with what the farm was for.

Hannah: 17:30

Willie was cheap and buying livestock and wouldn't care if the livestock was damaged. So he would take home like blind cow and just didn't care where the food came from. Which I thought that wasn't me just coming up with something. That was an example they gave, which there's a blind cow for the record.

Jess: 17:47

I mean, would it taste different if it were blind like what I?

Hannah: 17:51

don't know I doubt it but he would also buy auctioned cars and leave them around the property. He would strip them for parts after butchering. He would take the bones and carcasses and bury them in piles around the property. So he would fill a pile full of bones and whatever else, bulldoze dirt over and then make dig a new hole. Sounds like fun.

Courtney: 18:18

I think it's more odd that he didn't like bury the whole animal together, like he was just kind of like oh, all of these animals died at the same time.

Hannah: 18:25

No, because he was butchering them for food, so he would take the food off of it and then still.

Courtney: 18:31

Yeah, I don't know the way that's worded. Piles of bones.

Hannah: 18:36

Yeah, this is only 100 pages into the book everybody.

Courtney: 18:39

Jeez, Jeez. Only what like 200 more to go.

Rob: 18:43

More like 300.

Courtney: 18:44

More like 500. Oh my gosh, this is almost a 700 page book. It is. Yeah. Oh, I saw acknowledgments at like 600 and, just kidding, 705 is where the acknowledgments start at the back of the book.

Hannah: 19:00

Since Willie had a skill for stripping cars, his brother got him to start doing it for the Hells Angels. His brother had this obsession with the Hells Angels. He got his own bike. He wanted to be a part of them. He thought this was going to be an in the farm was becoming known for partying and having a good time. People that have been interviewed described Willie as more introverted and protective of his space. His bedroom was in the basement, obviously with a couple knickknacks, including the head he had taxi journeyed of his horse when he had to put it down, and a lone mattress with a black stain on it and a couple family pieces of memorabilia I wonder what that black stain was, because he was dirty.

Jess: 19:39

Oh, I mean, yeah, sweat, I guess. At least that's what I thought. I don't know what. I thought I was thinking blood, blood.

Hannah: 19:46

Maybe it was his oh man, censorship one time, one time, some of the females known to the farm went to his bedroom because they just he wanted to see it. For some odd reason he threatened to kill her if she ever stepped back into his space again but why would she want to go?

Jess: 20:03

morbid curiosity.

Hannah: 20:04

Yeah, his friend her friend brought her there was like you want to see his bedroom no in the early 1980s willie started bringing the unwanted vats of animal carcasses to a place in town called the west coast reduction, which was a rendering center. If willie did not bring the gallon drums, the reduction center would pick them up on the farm. Animal carcasses to a place in town called the West Coast Reduction, which was a rendering center. If Willie did not bring the gallon drums, the reduction center would pick them up on the farm. In a normal week it could be between two to five 45-gallon drums and the meat was black. Big chunks of carcass Sounds delicious Again, I hope no one ate before they listened or is are eating Any thoughts?

Courtney: 20:42

No, we we're just gonna keep going. Sounds delicious, just scowls. That's pretty much what went around disgusting yeah okay, moving on.

Jess: 20:54

Well, I'm just wondering like so it was all the excess, like the?

Hannah: 21:00

the so. So the gentleman that they interviewed that worked at the organs rendering plant of some whatever some sort, he thought it was weird because he thought there was too much meat on the bones that was left like he didn't, like he wasn't taking all of it off.

Courtney: 21:14

yeah, so he was like what is he doing if he's using this for food? Okay, red flag.

Hannah: 21:18

But also no one questioned anything. You could put whatever the fuck you want, if it smelled bad people didn't ask any questions.

Jess: 21:24

Oh, so I see where this is going.

Courtney: 21:26

I've been waiting for the plot twist for, like we're almost there, the plot twist, I think, is coming 27 minutes.

Hannah: 21:39

Yeah, twist is coming next episode. Sorry, you're gonna have to come back, okay. Okay, nothing was questioned about what was in the barrels. These byproducts could be used for things this is awful, such as soap to animal feed this is what this plant did to hot dogs soap to animal feed, so not not processed food for human consumption.

Rob: 21:58

So that makes me feel a little better.

Hannah: 22:00

Oh, hold on, hold on. There was like a whole list. Hold on Hold, please.

Hannah: 22:04

And she's going to quote, and I'm going to quote Okay, cosmetics, soaps, paint, plastics, candles, textiles so animal consumption, not human consumption. But honestly, I've gotten soap in my mouth before. No-transcript, Because Willie was venturing to town, which the area was known as Downtown Eastside. He was seeing the women on the streets and was fascinated by them. Not only was he getting this exposure but, since his brother was associated with the Hell's Angels, it's because the nurses that showed him their titties.

Courtney: 22:38

Yep, they created this problem.

Hannah: 22:39

It wasn't the nurses, it was the girls that were there.

Courtney: 22:44

Oh, you just assumed they were nurses because they were women.

Hannah: 22:48

yeah, no it was like it was like the children that were there oh okay, I didn't understand yeah, I didn't get that either.

Courtney: 22:57

I thought it was people who were there. Oh, it's like these disabled girls yeah, that makes way more sense. Way, yeah, okay, all right.

Hannah: 23:05

I was like is this really far-fetched?

Courtney: 23:06

Like I thought okay, we really thought that it was like hospital staff. It was like oh you poor thing, here's some booze. Yes, that's what.

Hannah: 23:14

I assumed, my bad, everybody. No, it was. It was like the patients there yes.

Courtney: 23:20

All right, let's start over. It was not their fault. I strike what we said.

Jess: 23:26

It was not their fault. I'm sorry, I should have described that better If they are doing that, because we all know what's going on.

Hannah: 23:33

Yes, Okay, sorry, I didn't explain that better, guys, it's fine, good story Good story.

Hannah: 23:43

Not only was he getting this exposure but since his brother was associated with the Hell's Angels, that was a place where women were exploited as well. So between his mother and how men were treating women in these other places, willie did not have a good representation of how women should be treated. Ew, I am not trying to make excuses, but things start adding up. You're just giving an explanation. Yes, exactly, from a mental health perspective, willie's dave had more and more people over, some from the hell's angels and some were people that worked for him.

Hannah: 24:13

People got creeped out by willie so finally dave wanted him out. He was given a motor home at the edge of the property. This motor home could be easily moved to other pieces of land that dave had investments at that they owned. So dave was hoping that he could watch out for the pieces of property. At one point willie moved the trailer closer to the downtown east side where he would pick up women for a little company, if you know what I mean, and he would frequent the bars and or tell the women of the night to buy drugs and they could go party at his place. Willie was not lacking in cash. His sister had been making deals for the land they owned and selling it piece by piece. Willie got parts of the profit, so he would go around downtown with wads of cash in his pocket.

Jess: 24:54

Is that a wad of cash in your pocket?

Courtney: 24:56

or are you just?

Jess: 24:57

happy to see me.

Courtney: 24:58

I guess his answer was both yeah.

Hannah: 25:01

I am not impressed by the Vancouver Police Department, for what I have read. There was a reporter named Kim Pemberton who seemed to be one of the biggest advocates for murdered prostitutes. There was a man named Gilbert Paul Jordan who was having women gorge alcohol and then watch them die. The police knew who it was because when they would get another dead prostitute they said, oh, it's just Jordan-esque.

Jess: 25:28

That pisses me off, because you see it in so many cases where police just don't care because they're prostitutes. Yep right, the police were not interested enough yep, it's terrible.

Rob: 25:34

And these women were prostitutes, but also a lot of them were native women too, so there was a lot of just not giving a shit, yeah we were watching cops the other day and one of the episodes was where they would do a raid on prostitutes and stuff and the prostitutes would just get in the car. And I said no wonder why serial killers pick prostitutes, because they literally just walk right in your car I mean, if you're gonna 100 bucks is 100 bucks, but also no, these girls are getting like 15, 15, 20 dollars.

Rob: 26:05

It was.

Hannah: 26:06

But also they're probably under the influence $15, $20. It was also the late 90s.

Courtney: 26:10

Prices have gone up Inflation, am I right? I don't think so, Rob. What do you know about?

Rob: 26:14

$20 is $20.

Courtney: 26:17

You can find. Rob on the corner in Springfield.

Rob: 26:21

The corner of school and high.

Jess: 26:23

Robert, would you suck a dick for 20 bucks Rob?

Rob: 26:29

Negative.

Hannah: 26:30

Lies 20, bucks is 20 bucks, he did say it, he did say 20 bucks is 20 bucks, but if you're Desperate for money, hungry, you need a fix.

Courtney: 26:40

Maybe you have a family, know where to stay.

Hannah: 26:42

Right, there's a lot of different reasons. A lot of times mental health is involved, so they're not really in their right mind when they make that decision either.

Hannah: 26:50

Yep, it was Kim and other reporters that finally got the police to look into it thoroughly. And Jordan did get jail time but it was manslaughter and he got out of it. He got out later. So he went to time for manslaughter, not murder, and then he got out. I know this isn't about picked in, but it definitely gives you a picture of how vancouver was towards murder and prostitutes, especially those killed or missing in the downtown east side you still want to move there, rob?

Rob: 27:16

hell yeah, I would love to move to canada anyway, as you were.

Hannah: 27:20

So also, there was actually another um, not just this jordan, but there was another serial killer that was talked about in the book. So there was a lot. I mean, I know Canada's big, but all in one time I thought that was interesting. This police department was not painted in a good light. The author Cameron does a great job talking about some of the missing women during these decades. They all have different stories and I would need another episode just to talk about their stories and they will break your heart. Women that deserve to have a voice, and it goes to show you that this can happen to anyone. So some of them are just. There was one woman who was actually from california and her parents were canadian, so they moved back to canada because she got a habit of some sort from drugs, hoping if she went to canada everything would get better. It ended up getting worse. They couldn't find her. She was like, hey, I want to come home for christmas. They send her money and then they never see her again so she's just missing.

Hannah: 28:15

So just heartbreaking stories of just people that are missing, not necessarily because of picton, but just during this whole time frame in this area. Yeah, so that's episode one, but just some background on not giving picton an excuse. But there was a lot of shit to unpack he had a fucked up childhood. Yeah no one believed in him. I feel like that was part of the problem that's a big thing, that I definitely heard too.

Courtney: 28:41

Yeah for sure. Even his mom, who he self-identified was yeah, two peas in a pod didn't believe in him, yep, and his dad was abusive.

Hannah: 28:51

His brother wasn't any help. No, his sister abandoned him in reality, right. And then his people he may have looked up to were individuals that have their own issues. At the asylum or the specialty school. His own teachers told him he needed special ed.

Jess: 29:11

He didn't stand a chance really.

Hannah: 29:13

Not making an excuse. I just want to make that clear.

Courtney: 29:18

We know, hannah. It's underlined and bolded. Yes.

Rob: 29:22

Bolded, underlined and italicized.

Jess: 29:30

Ta-da. That's it, thank you. Definitely want to brush up on my willie picton because I've heard about it. This book was actually in my tbr, but uh, now I don't think I want to read it.

Courtney: 29:37

If it's, I'll take a summary. I think it was in mine too all right, pick a card, any card all right, this is the five of spades.

Hannah: 29:51

Yes, okay, I was getting spade and club mixed up for some reason. Spade- looks like a shovel I know, but their shovels look different. Eduardo troche jr. On september 26 2017, the victim was shot on the front porch of 119 congress avenue in chelsea. An individual in a gray sedan was observed shooting. If you have any info about this case, please call 1-855-MA-SOLVE. I'm always sad after I read these. I know, right, there's never a comment to be made. I know.

Jess: 30:28

Please call if you have any information. That's exactly the voice I was thinking about every time. I say that 60 minutes no, no, it's unsolved mysteries.

Courtney: 30:39

That makes sense. Plot moment. You can dye the hair, but it's still blonde. I.

Hannah: 30:45

I like your new hair color, though Thank you.

Jess: 30:47

You're welcome, I do too. I do too. Well, thanks for that episode. I'm excited to hear Ready for number two.

Courtney: 30:55

Can't wait for parts two, three and four. Yes, yeah, maybe seven parts, like 100 pages per part.

Hannah: 31:01

I'll try to make it just two Pretty much, but I thought the background was super important.

Courtney: 31:05

Yeah, it definitely is.

Jess: 31:08

Faux show, so thank you.

Rob: 31:11

Like and subscribe. If you're listening on Spotify, definitely give us five stars. If you're on Apple Music or whenever it's called Apple Podcast, make sure to leave us a comment and rate us. We do appreciate it and the algorithm Loves it. And buy some of our merch that has. Leave us a comment and rate us. We do appreciate it and the algorithm loves it.

Rob: 31:27

And buy some of our merch that has new, lower prices and we should have stickers soon, and a lot of the T-shirts and hoodies added some new colors, so if there was a color there that you didn't like before check it out, link is down in the show notes. Also, if you want to send us a text message, link's in the show notes.

Hannah: 31:46

Yeah, Cousin Mark has been bomb with the text messages.

Rob: 31:52

Yes, I want to give a shout out to my cousin Mark. He binged all of our episodes in less than a week.

Jess: 31:57

Oh my God, yeah, hey, mark, the fucking Putnams, fucking Putnams, the fucking Putnams he will love the shout out. He loves our.

Courtney: 32:10

Actually, you know what?

Rob: 32:12

He sent us a fan mail today and I should read it.

Hannah: 32:18

The chicken coop. Yeah, all the cases he sent, I have them like saved on my internet thing.

Rob: 32:24

Let's see.

Jess: 32:29

Actually I'll let hannah read these.

Hannah: 32:30

Oh okay, I'll start with the oldest and come to the I just listened to the diet love pass episode and listening to the final words, it seems to me they all thought it was an avalanche they were experiencing, got as fast as they could, then got disoriented by the panic. That's when everything went to shit. I've listened to a few podcasts on this and I never thought of it till now.

Jess: 32:47

However, mark, the degree of the mountain that they were on is not conducive to like the full-blown avalanche that we think of, so I recommend you watching that episode of Expedition Unknown and come back and we can have a chat.

Hannah: 33:08

Cousin Mark here listening to your text message show and I'm suggesting the chicken coop murder.

Rob: 33:12

Cousin Mark here.

Hannah: 33:17

I've caught up and need more episodes, yeah Well, here is another.

Rob: 33:22

Here you go.

Hannah: 33:23

Thanks Mark, thanks Mark and thank you Wanderers, thank you Courtney and Courtney, thank you for having me.

Rob: 33:29

Thank you, and if you want to be a paid subscriber, we have bonus material available. Links in the show notes Bye, bye.

Hannah: 33:36

Thanks for listening today. Wicked Wanderings is hosted by Hannah Fitzpatrick and me, jess Goonan.

Rob: 33:42

And it's produced by Rob Fitzpatrick.

Hannah: 33:44

Music by Sasha N. If you enjoyed today's episode, don't forget to leave us a rating and review and be sure to follow us on all our socials.

Jess: 33:53

You can find the links down in the show notes.

Hannah: 33:58

And if you're looking for some Wicked Cozy t-shirts or hoodies, head over to our merch store.

Jess: 34:00

Thank you for being a part of the Wicked Wanderings community.

Hannah: 34:04

We appreciate each and every one of you Stay curious, keep exploring and always remember to keep on wandering. Thank you.